77 liquifire problems

General topics related to John Deere Snowmobiles
Post Reply
User avatar
WoodlandSerenade
Posts: 19
Joined: Sun Sep 15, 2013 1:25 pm
Real Name: Ian Martin
Location: Michigan

77 liquifire problems

Post by WoodlandSerenade »

Alright, so I just ran the liquifire for more than a few minutes since I had bought it, and I noticed the large volume of smoke which bellowed from the exhaust, an idle around 3k rpm, as well as a small puddle of what could've only been unburnt fuel :wall: . I was wondering what could be causing any of these issues. I recently disassembled both of the carbs and cleaned and adjusted them back to the specifications in the service manual, as well as synchronizing them, so that might possibly have something to do with problems two and three. The large volume of smoke however, I am not as sure about. Naturally, that is the basis of my inquiry, although I would like to know what you all think as far as all three of the problems. I plan on lifting the engine out to figure this out, so what are some specific things I should look for in relation to these issues. Thanks in advance! :)
Holly, Mi.

'77 Liquifire 440
User avatar
Danzig
Posts: 4431
Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: Paul File
Location: Van Orin, Illinois

Re: 77 liquifire problems

Post by Danzig »

Seems to be just fine....you have it loaded up on fuel, the bottom end is flooded, get it on a stand after the engine is warm and crank up the rpms.
1973 JDX8
1978 Liquifire 340
1980 Liquifire 440 CC Racer
1980 Liquifire 440
1982 Liquifire 440


"Gotta Lick It Before You Stick It"
User avatar
WoodlandSerenade
Posts: 19
Joined: Sun Sep 15, 2013 1:25 pm
Real Name: Ian Martin
Location: Michigan

Re: 77 liquifire problems

Post by WoodlandSerenade »

Okay, thanks. Should I try a smaller jet while I'm at it? The manual recommends a 210 at my elevation and the carbs have 220's in them now.
Holly, Mi.

'77 Liquifire 440
User avatar
Danzig
Posts: 4431
Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: Paul File
Location: Van Orin, Illinois

Re: 77 liquifire problems

Post by Danzig »

Always start with what the manufact. recommends and you can improve from there.
1973 JDX8
1978 Liquifire 340
1980 Liquifire 440 CC Racer
1980 Liquifire 440
1982 Liquifire 440


"Gotta Lick It Before You Stick It"
lwb140
Posts: 1807
Joined: Fri May 08, 2009 11:34 pm
Real Name: Wade bennett
Location: linden IN

Re: 77 liquifire problems

Post by lwb140 »

id wouldnt go crazy rejetting unless the elevation you are running the sled at has changed , most often it seems the jetting is set conservative to avoid lean engine damage. I tend to agree it doesn't sound like there is anything too terribly wrong with you sled that a good reaming out wouldn't help , also it the sled has sat for periods of time with mixed gas in it the gas tends to evaporated leaving the oil behind causing the fresh gas to be extra oily , sometimes just some miles will help things. have you replaced the crank seals ?? I would recommend that for sure wade
certificate recipiant of the 12 vintage challenge !! on a 78 liquifre 440,
certificate recipiant of the 13 vintage challenge !! on a 340/s
certificate recipient of the 14 vintage challenge !! on a 78 liquifire 440
joe forgot the certificates for the 2015 vintage challenge
crossed the start/finish line twice at the 2013 and 2014 I500 on a 78 liquifire 440
User avatar
WoodlandSerenade
Posts: 19
Joined: Sun Sep 15, 2013 1:25 pm
Real Name: Ian Martin
Location: Michigan

Re: 77 liquifire problems

Post by WoodlandSerenade »

I apologize for resurrecting this dead thread, but I may have some extra clues as to why the sled might be acting up as it is. Before I get into that; however, I must say that late last year, I completely rebuilt the engine and fuel pump, probably more for piece-of-mind, as the previous owner said his brother used it for grass drags, and even with an old pressure gague, I had about 115-95 compression, with the PTO cylinder being 95. I haven't had a chance to do another test, but filling the fuel lines after rebuilding the fuel pump, I nearly tore my arm off. Even though it still starts with a single pull, I've got to use both arms and a solid stance :)
Anyway, I dragged her out yesterday as me and a buddy were trying to dial in the carbs, and after a couple of pulls, she started and the idle was as it was last year; steady at 3,000. We began by following the How To Fine Tune... manual's recommendation on setting the idle air and stop screws, and after a while, the idle magically worked its way down to 2,500, then a steady 1,800, and would not raise up again unless one of us gave her a quick tug on the throttle, which would keep the RPMs up for a period of time somewhere between 5 seconds and a minute or so. The sled would also idle erratically extremely-low whenever i put choke on it, however I am also sure that the plungers are seating correctly. Because of this, we weren't able to do much tuning on her because the idle was just too unstable. We also observed that if one was to lift on the throttle cable splitter box, the RPMs would raise to oh, 2500 or so. There was also the rich plumes of smoke I have spoken of previously, as well as a nice puddle of unburnt fuel on the ground, as well as around and under the exhaust joint in the bellypan.
Long story short, would my issues with running rich, having a high idle, spewing fuel out the exhaust, etc. be due to a bad throttle cable and a main jet a single size off, or is there some larger problem.:wall: Keep in mind, this engine has a fresh rebuild, and I have cleaned the carbs multiple times now. Thank you.
Holly, Mi.

'77 Liquifire 440
Cabindweller
Posts: 561
Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2008 12:00 am
Real Name: Jerry Zebro
Location: Ridgeland WI

Re: 77 liquifire problems

Post by Cabindweller »

Your main jet is not part of the idle circuit. Unless you have opened it up past 3/4 throttle you haven't even involved the main jet. A couple of things I would look at. Sounds like a plug fouling issue to me. Check over your ignition system, make sure you have good plugs and good spark. Things in the fuel system I would look into are, hung up choke plungers or a bad needle and seat in one or both of the carbs.

Jerry
Old sleds are hours of entertainment.... then you get to ride them for a little bit.
User avatar
WoodlandSerenade
Posts: 19
Joined: Sun Sep 15, 2013 1:25 pm
Real Name: Ian Martin
Location: Michigan

Re: 77 liquifire problems

Post by WoodlandSerenade »

I have just checked, and both plugs have great spark. The plugs are BR9ES, and from what I can understand, they run a little hotter than the B10ES' I see recommended. With any luck, I should be able to check out the carbs in the next couple of days.
Holly, Mi.

'77 Liquifire 440
User avatar
PolCat
Posts: 82
Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2013 4:56 pm
Location: Green Bay, Wi

Re: 77 liquifire problems

Post by PolCat »

Have you ohmed out the stator yet? There is a idle winding and a high rev winding. It sounds like it is not making
the transition to the high speed windings. Check out this post on here. http://www.jdsleds.com/community/viewto ... ?f=5&t=289
My 76 had the opposite problem it wouldn't start.
"There's No Iron Like Old Iron"
Post Reply