108EXP clutch setup

[SIIaCanuck]

Update:

Old clutch removed:

One 3/4"x2" UNF bolt + One 5/16"x4-1/2" bolt (with head rounded on bench grinder) + propane torch = Comet 102C clutch puller.

Procedure:

1. Shot of penetrating lube on crank/clutch join. Possibly useless step unless you take a month.
2. Insert modified 5/16" bolt into clutch with dab of high-pressure lube on head.
3. Insert 3/4" bolt into clutch with light machine oil on threads.
4. Torque up 3/4" bolt to the point where a metric fine thread would be considering stripping out (when the hair on your neck starts to lift, balls start to tingle, mouth goes dry or equivalent).
5. Add 1/16 turn.
6. Heat clutch fixed face stem as quickly as possible.
7. Give 3/4" bolt head a 'tap'.
8. Hear 'ting', 'pop', 'clunk' or similar as taper releases.

Voila! One clutch out of sled.

Chain case:

Old gears out, 1.86 (39/21) gears in. These came out of my 440 Trailfire parts sled along with 66 link chain.

Fortunately, a previous owner had installed 1.77 (39/22) gears and a 68 link chain. This is the correct chain for both 1.77 and 1.86 gearing so I'm very happy for the good fortune of useful alternative gearing (instead of 1.56 gears) and a useful chain to match. If I find the 1.86 gears are limiting me on the top end (ya right I hear you all say) then I've got a good alternative. Maybe I'll fit them in for the day my cousins decide we need to do speed runs down the lake.


Anyway, I'm still waiting for the third weight for my 108EXP. It's due in on Friday but it was also due in on the 20th of November.

I'm planning to put in new crank seals tomorrow, put in the Polaris flywheel, stator and CDI and clean up the 102C with a new spring and re-button the secondary. I'll put her back together that way and work on getting her running with the new ignition and safe timing.

I'll take photographs of the whole ignition installation (I'm essentially copying 'Checkmarks' install in his Kwak Invader) and post them with the results. That way you'll all be able to tell me what I did wrong if I blow up / melt something or copy me if I end up with a running 1980 Liquifire with HSR courtesy of an old Indy 400.


I'm really hoping for the latter. I've got a big family BBQing, sledding and pond hockey event on the 26th and I don't want to have to borrow one of my cousins' late model Polaris, Doo or Cat sleds.

[SIIaCanuck]

Oh yes, I forgot to mention I've ordered a red spring and C-2 weights and some spring shims as well.

The Comet 102/108C engagement chart shows 4900rpm for B-1 & purple and 4700rpm for C-2 & red. The Comet 108EXP engagement chart shows 4500rpm and 4600rpm for the same combinations. I've got a set of preload shims as well, should give approx. 100rpm per shim for fine tuning.

If anyone knows why the 108C and EXP clutches engage differently with the same weight/spring combo, I'd love to know.

Regardless, I'm hoping that the HSR ignition and lower gearing help reduce any tendency to bog. I'll play with both combinations and shimming the spring to get a setup that snaps off the line the way I like.

[SIIaCanuck]

Update for today:

Secondary refreshed with new buttons and ready for a 1-3/8" belt. '80 limiter washer dealt with by using my Sportfire secondary with the LIquifire helix. Re-fitted but not torqued onto the jackshaft yet as I need to check/set alignment once I've got the primary fitted. I'll remove the limiter washer on my original secondary when I have some spare time so I'll have a spare on the shelf.

Thought I'd clean up the 102 seeing as I was still one weight short for the EXP. Dipped into my parts box to find that the two weights I'd been sent were HE-5 anyway, not B-1. Stripped down the 102 to find three good B-1 weights but with worn bushings. The clutch was filthy and one weight was actually stiff to move. Old purple spring was pretty shot, I'll post a picture next to the NOS spring I had on the bench.

Called the shop that got me the new weights and they can re-bush my old ones tomorrow and refund me for the HE-5 weights.

My EXP uses 1/4" bolts, so a re-bush and they'll work like a charm.

Log into eBay, find a set of B-1 weights going, 'buy it now' and I now have a set of spares.

Separately, I talk to Royal Distributing and they'll have me a set of C-2 weights before the end of the month ish. I've got a red spring coming on Friday so that's the other combo sorted. Comet clutches and parts are back in production but B-1 weights are discontinued. Not much use if the clutch tuning guide specifies B-1 and purple spring.

While I was at it, I drained the oil pump gear case and threw in some new oil. Also replaced the PTO end crank seal. The old one looked OK but who knows how old it was and it's exposed to all the dust and whatever behind the clutch.

Got the recoil pulled from the mag end of the crank. Flywheel being stubborn and my puller doesn't fit very well. Got it torqued up and gave it a few sharp taps but no movement. I shot on some Liquid Wrench and left it for the night. I'll try to pick up a better puller while I'm in town tomorrow.

Got home and I suspect my wife has put a spare Dayco MAX1105M3 under the tree.

Now that's a good day on the ranch in my book! Anyway, I have a 2-yr-old who wants to 'wide Daddy snowobeow' so I better get this thing running.

New spring next to old:


Purple spring and B-1 weights; combo 1 in Stew's EXP clutch experiment:

[SIIaCanuck]

OK, today was only partly successful. On checking receipt, it turns out that I got my shops mixed up.

Shop that got me the wrong weights have a 30 day returns policy and no returns on special orders. It's past 30 days and the weights were a special order. If they'd got me two B-1 weights as I had ordered, and then I'd changed my mind, I would be willing to walk away. HoweverI'm going to talk to the manager to explain that neither case counts when the invoice states '1980 LIquifire' and the clutch parts supplied are not for a 1980 LF. I now have one weight (obtained through a third shop) and am having to re-bush and reuse my old weights (look like B-3).

PITA

The other shop, the one I prefer, is a better case. Turns out that one of his guys sold two clutch weight bushings out of his last package so I'll have to wait for the re-bush job. So, no quick return to the snow. However, the good news is that he's bought out a couple of shops who carried John Deere stuff (he is a Kawi dealer) and has NOS jugs for the LF, a 340S motor (needs crank) and lots of small bits. I'll be returning with my parts manual in hand to see what I can tuck away for a rainy day.

If anyone needs a 340S motor, let me know and I'll get you a phone number.

[Ryker Carruthers]

Before I get my B weights for my liquifire, I thought i'd go out to the shop and see what I could conglomerate with what i've got. I found the lightest weight on hand (F) and the heaviest spring, Green/yellow. Engagement is a hair over 4000 but mind you everything I have is used so the spring Is probably wore out. I have my helix in hole 4 and wound back 1/3 of a turn. Ill let you know how it works. We are supposed to get 4-8" between today and tomorrow. Dear Santa, this year all I want is snow... And a set of B weights for my liquifire... Lol
Ryker