Idler wheel update

[400brian]

I have added this to the topic in the FAQs, but wanted everyone to see this:

In the 8 years since we first started rebuilding idler wheels, we have learned a couple of things.

We have experienced some bearing failures far too early, particularly in the wheels that have the smaller opening in the aluminum center that did not use the separate seals.

Premium bearings are my best recommendation at this point. A couple of possibilities:

Wahl racing sells a NTN bearing they use in their ice racing skids. If these were unacceptable I assume they would hear about it in short order.
I am rebuilding the idlers in my X8 for the first time now, and I am going to test these. Joe Rainville is also planning to test these in his Dator race sled.

Matt Gabler tells me that he has been using a Koyo bearing in the idlers he has been rebuilding for the guys running the 78 CC skids that Brock Weber has been cloning. He tells me it is bearing: 62052RSNRC3. I believe the C3 suffix indicates that this is an electric motor bearing. Dustin Elder reports that they have ran these hard, and have had no failures to date.

Water infiltration is obviously the problem here. High quality seals are what you need.

[idMXLT]

C3 indicates the radial clearance group of the bearing. C3 & C4 are looser than a "normal" bearing.

http://omtbearing.com/archives/237

[jep_800]

I have used NTN with my X8 with good results so far. But then again, this is the first set for me, so I hope they last awhile.

JP

[JDGuy]

Over the years I have used bearings from several well known manufacturers, and also popped out the seals, cleaned, re-lubed, re-sealed and reused if there was no corrosion, all on wheels with snap ring bearing retention. For re-lubing I once tried the expensive Dow 100% silicone premium grease and that did not seem to work significantly better, it still washed out or pushed out. I had a friend that was a FAG bearing rep and he gave me a bundle of new seals to use after re-lubing their bearings, the results were the same. The various bearings that I tried were only good for a couple of seasons or so depending upon mileage and speed before needing lubrication. I think they warm, then cool in the snow when stopped and suck in water. Those little wheels spin pretty fast at speed. Then I tried the "NTN Formula" bearings that were advertised for snowmobiles, double lip seals vs. the common single lip, low temp water resistant grease, etc. They out performed the others by several times. They were not inexpensive and I am uncertain of current day availability. The key at the time was the "Formula" designation.

[AirborneX4Special]

Bogie wheel bearing failure rate was another big reason after ride quality that slide rail suspensions quickly became the skid of choice. The more modern skids had more idler wheels than the initial setups but that naturally leads to more moving parts to fail over time, but still fewer than a bogie suspension. I never owned a bogie sled but all my friends who had them carried spare bogies if they could.

[400brian]

This wheel was for a 340/S, and is the design I have had the most experience with. I believe it is the second design idler. The first has a smaller opening in the aluminum center, and does not use the separate seals and open bearing, it uses a sealed bearing.

I would love to find a source for the seals pictured below. Does anyone know what they are called? I have searched for everything I can think to call them, and have found nothing close. They are like a thin shim washer with a seal bonded on to it. They seal against the reducer bushing, not the bearing per se.

Can anyone help?

[400brian]

The bolt I have been using for the last ten years or so to support the rivet heads when setting the shop side, had gotten pounded pretty much flat.
I picked up a hardened tool to fix this. This is a replacement part for a tool called a rivet squeezer. I bought this off ebay for less than $7.
I squared up the end of my bolt, then drilled a 3/16" hole down the center. I had to open up the hole with a 1/4 drill at the very top to accommodate the fillet at the head of the rivet set. A little yamabond on the shank, and after that sets. it should be good to go.

[farleyjd400]

I just started rebuilding my own idler wheels and have had good luck so far. Are you guys saying that the bearings I have been getting from McMaster will not hole up very long?