Cyclones!!!

This is where you can post the story & photos of your John Deere Snowmobile project.
Post Reply
User avatar
400brian
Posts: 5626
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: James T. Kirk
Location: South Central Wisconsin

Re: Cyclones!!!

Post by 400brian »

The drivers were in decent condition, but after cleaning the shaft up so I could move them inward for re-assembly, I found them to be quite loose on the shaft. I tried a set of new Kimpex drivers, and they fit snuggly, so the OEM drivers will go on the injured reserve list.
Attachments
thumbnail (23).jpg

'09 Vintage Challenge Survivor, and I wasn't late for supper!
'10, '11, '12, '13,'14,'15,'16,'17, '18, 19, 20, 21, 22 Vintage Challenge Survivor !
72 400 restored, Father bought new in '71
73 X8 restored
'74 340 green machine
'74 X8 9 time VC finisher
'78 Spitfire in progress
2 '75 340S 1 running, one on deck
'78 LF 440 future CC clone
'73 Skiroule RTX 440, 500 mi.
User avatar
400brian
Posts: 5626
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: James T. Kirk
Location: South Central Wisconsin

Re: Cyclones!!!

Post by 400brian »

So as I said earlier, the 78 suspension installs a bit differently than the 76. The 76 has steel brackets that bolt to the underside of the foot boards that go up inside the tunnel. On the 78 there are small 1/16" thick steel pads riveted to the inside of the tunnel where the bolts go through to protect the tunnel. Everything about the 78 suspension is lighter and simplified. This also means that the 78 suspension tubes and shafts are longer, as the 76 wear brackets are much thicker.
Attachments
thumbnail (26).jpg

'09 Vintage Challenge Survivor, and I wasn't late for supper!
'10, '11, '12, '13,'14,'15,'16,'17, '18, 19, 20, 21, 22 Vintage Challenge Survivor !
72 400 restored, Father bought new in '71
73 X8 restored
'74 340 green machine
'74 X8 9 time VC finisher
'78 Spitfire in progress
2 '75 340S 1 running, one on deck
'78 LF 440 future CC clone
'73 Skiroule RTX 440, 500 mi.
User avatar
400brian
Posts: 5626
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: James T. Kirk
Location: South Central Wisconsin

Re: Cyclones!!!

Post by 400brian »

I measured the 78 at least three times, and transferred the hole locations into the 76 tunnel, and then spent most of a month checking and rechecking. I finally bit the bullet and drilled them. The steel pads were fabricated and installed, so the next thing was the driveshaft. I decided to try putting the bearing flanges in with carriage bolts, so they were sourced, along with a new o-ring. This whole operation is my least favorite job, but it is always good to get it behind you and get the sled back on its feet, so you just have to do it.

With the sled on its back and up on saw horses, it goes about as good as it is going to. The shaft went in without a fight, so I am now ready to wrestle in the suspension.
Attachments
thumbnail (25).jpg
thumbnail (27).jpg
thumbnail (28).jpg
Last edited by 400brian on Tue Oct 18, 2022 1:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

'09 Vintage Challenge Survivor, and I wasn't late for supper!
'10, '11, '12, '13,'14,'15,'16,'17, '18, 19, 20, 21, 22 Vintage Challenge Survivor !
72 400 restored, Father bought new in '71
73 X8 restored
'74 340 green machine
'74 X8 9 time VC finisher
'78 Spitfire in progress
2 '75 340S 1 running, one on deck
'78 LF 440 future CC clone
'73 Skiroule RTX 440, 500 mi.
User avatar
400brian
Posts: 5626
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: James T. Kirk
Location: South Central Wisconsin

Re: Cyclones!!!

Post by 400brian »

Suspension is in! Always a milestone for me.
Attachments
thumbnail (33).jpg
thumbnail (31).jpg
thumbnail (30).jpg
thumbnail (29).jpg

'09 Vintage Challenge Survivor, and I wasn't late for supper!
'10, '11, '12, '13,'14,'15,'16,'17, '18, 19, 20, 21, 22 Vintage Challenge Survivor !
72 400 restored, Father bought new in '71
73 X8 restored
'74 340 green machine
'74 X8 9 time VC finisher
'78 Spitfire in progress
2 '75 340S 1 running, one on deck
'78 LF 440 future CC clone
'73 Skiroule RTX 440, 500 mi.
User avatar
400brian
Posts: 5626
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: James T. Kirk
Location: South Central Wisconsin

Re: Cyclones!!!

Post by 400brian »

So now I can look at the other side. Pretty greasy, need to get things cleaned up before I can go any farther.
Attachments
thumbnail (32).jpg

'09 Vintage Challenge Survivor, and I wasn't late for supper!
'10, '11, '12, '13,'14,'15,'16,'17, '18, 19, 20, 21, 22 Vintage Challenge Survivor !
72 400 restored, Father bought new in '71
73 X8 restored
'74 340 green machine
'74 X8 9 time VC finisher
'78 Spitfire in progress
2 '75 340S 1 running, one on deck
'78 LF 440 future CC clone
'73 Skiroule RTX 440, 500 mi.
User avatar
400brian
Posts: 5626
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: James T. Kirk
Location: South Central Wisconsin

Re: Cyclones!!!

Post by 400brian »

Plastic skis are on deck to go on this sled, but for the time being, the spindles have had the dingleberry hone ran through them, the bushings and bolts have been cleaned up, and the steel skis have been temporarily re-installed.
Attachments
thumbnail (34).jpg

'09 Vintage Challenge Survivor, and I wasn't late for supper!
'10, '11, '12, '13,'14,'15,'16,'17, '18, 19, 20, 21, 22 Vintage Challenge Survivor !
72 400 restored, Father bought new in '71
73 X8 restored
'74 340 green machine
'74 X8 9 time VC finisher
'78 Spitfire in progress
2 '75 340S 1 running, one on deck
'78 LF 440 future CC clone
'73 Skiroule RTX 440, 500 mi.
User avatar
JoeRainville
Posts: 4355
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: "John Deere Joe"
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
Contact:

Re: Cyclones!!!

Post by JoeRainville »

Progress looks good Lindner, but a few observations.

1) You are going to hell in a handbasket for turning your back on your beloved mid-mounts

2) It looks to be easier to re-cleat a track in your shop, on a work bench than it does at 1 AM at the Whitetail Lodge

3) Those crank seals looked MINT, LOL!

4) You can replace crank seals on a 70's Liquifire with the motor in the chassis, but I don't recommend it

5) A KEC340 or 440/22 is right up your ally...

See you in a few weeks!
-JDJR
Honorary Tech Editor

Chuck Norris doesn't get frost bite. He bites the frost.
User avatar
400brian
Posts: 5626
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: James T. Kirk
Location: South Central Wisconsin

Re: Cyclones!!!

Post by 400brian »

So when we pulled up to the door of the Whitetail Lodge Memorial weekend, Don and Patty Amber were sitting on the bench outside. As soon as we were checked in, we were back out in the parking lot, and I took delivery of a pair of steel brackets for plastic skis, and a set of hyfax.

We had rain this past weekend, so I assembled the plastic skis, and after a fresh coat of paint, added the leaf springs.

Straight Line Tracking plastic skis, the steel brackets Busco Bullet sells, and Bergstrom Carbides with their ski savers.
Attachments
thumbnail (46).jpg
thumbnail (47).jpg
thumbnail (45).jpg

'09 Vintage Challenge Survivor, and I wasn't late for supper!
'10, '11, '12, '13,'14,'15,'16,'17, '18, 19, 20, 21, 22 Vintage Challenge Survivor !
72 400 restored, Father bought new in '71
73 X8 restored
'74 340 green machine
'74 X8 9 time VC finisher
'78 Spitfire in progress
2 '75 340S 1 running, one on deck
'78 LF 440 future CC clone
'73 Skiroule RTX 440, 500 mi.
User avatar
400brian
Posts: 5626
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: James T. Kirk
Location: South Central Wisconsin

Re: Cyclones!!!

Post by 400brian »

The chassis was placed on the stand and cranked up to a comfortable work height.

The pan on this sled is fairly straight, but it had been pushed up enough in the center to allow the steering drag link to rub. So I massaged the pan down to restore the clearance. The tool bag was as stiff as a poker and the zipper didn't work, so that was removed. As I began cleaning up the greasy goo inside the pan, I realized the tie rod had a bow in it, so I will have to look at my spares to see if I have a straight one on hand.
Attachments
thumbnail (51).jpg
thumbnail (48).jpg
thumbnail (49).jpg
thumbnail (50).jpg

'09 Vintage Challenge Survivor, and I wasn't late for supper!
'10, '11, '12, '13,'14,'15,'16,'17, '18, 19, 20, 21, 22 Vintage Challenge Survivor !
72 400 restored, Father bought new in '71
73 X8 restored
'74 340 green machine
'74 X8 9 time VC finisher
'78 Spitfire in progress
2 '75 340S 1 running, one on deck
'78 LF 440 future CC clone
'73 Skiroule RTX 440, 500 mi.
User avatar
400brian
Posts: 5626
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: James T. Kirk
Location: South Central Wisconsin

Re: Cyclones!!!

Post by 400brian »

It is always good to have a pile of parts to draw from. I dug through the stash and found a decent looking tie rod, so that is on deck.

The next thing is to get the inside of the pan cleaned up of the normal layer of greasy black goo. In the past I have pressure washed the tunnels out first thing. On this one, I began the build in December, so it was too cold for that. So now I am using a couple of products along with lots of paper towels to clean things up as best I can. Remember, this is a re-fresh as a rider, not a restoration.

On the Sunday we were driving the 2 miles over to the Round Up, Katy asked me if she should take some time off in January? I had no idea what she meant, so I asked her for what purpose? Her reply was not at all what I was expecting, as she replied that we should go up and ride the UP! Yeah, I didn't see that one coming. So, I need to get the sleds prepped, as there is just never enough time.
Attachments
thumbnail (52).jpg
thumbnail (53).jpg

'09 Vintage Challenge Survivor, and I wasn't late for supper!
'10, '11, '12, '13,'14,'15,'16,'17, '18, 19, 20, 21, 22 Vintage Challenge Survivor !
72 400 restored, Father bought new in '71
73 X8 restored
'74 340 green machine
'74 X8 9 time VC finisher
'78 Spitfire in progress
2 '75 340S 1 running, one on deck
'78 LF 440 future CC clone
'73 Skiroule RTX 440, 500 mi.
User avatar
400brian
Posts: 5626
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: James T. Kirk
Location: South Central Wisconsin

Re: Cyclones!!!

Post by 400brian »

Pecking away here and there.

So I pulled the speedo drive apart and found it totally dry ( first pic ). So I applied a bit of lithium grease to the shaft and gear, and a couple drops of oil into the half off the assembly that you can't take apart.

I struggled taking the drive off originally, as the socket kept slipping off the rounded pinch nuts, and the tight fit to the tin housing made it worse. For the first time, I installed these drive axle bearings with carriage bolts, kinda just to see how that worked out. I bolted the speedo drive on with regular nuts and lock washers, but I did apply Loctite as well. Oh, and I remembered to install the drive key!

The last pic is of the jackshaft. After some thought, I decided to replace the bearings. There seems to be nothing wrong with them, and new bearings will probably be of lower quality than the old ones, but if one should ever fail, the jokers I ride with will never let me forget it. So, new ones will be going in.
Attachments
thumbnail (59).jpg
thumbnail (57).jpg
thumbnail (58).jpg

'09 Vintage Challenge Survivor, and I wasn't late for supper!
'10, '11, '12, '13,'14,'15,'16,'17, '18, 19, 20, 21, 22 Vintage Challenge Survivor !
72 400 restored, Father bought new in '71
73 X8 restored
'74 340 green machine
'74 X8 9 time VC finisher
'78 Spitfire in progress
2 '75 340S 1 running, one on deck
'78 LF 440 future CC clone
'73 Skiroule RTX 440, 500 mi.
AirborneX4Special
Posts: 1450
Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2010 10:54 am
Real Name: Pat
Location: N. IL

Re: Cyclones!!!

Post by AirborneX4Special »

Jokers riding snowmobiles? No way....
User avatar
400brian
Posts: 5626
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: James T. Kirk
Location: South Central Wisconsin

Re: Cyclones!!!

Post by 400brian »

So it was time to get the chain case buttoned up. First I installed the washers and locking nuts on the driveshaft bearing bolts and tightened everything up for the last time. During initial assembly with the sled on it's back, I had just spun regular bolts on to apply pressure to the sealant on the flange gasket as it set up.

I reinstalled the chain sprockets with the same shim washers I had found on dis-assembly, and found the lower sprocket needed to be moved out substantially. The service manual gives the number of washers and the thicknesses of them for each shaft. I found the top shaft had no shims, and as the witness mark on the back side of the sprocket was eccentric ( like the bearing ), I don't believe it ever had any. At any rate, the book says to add or remove shims from the bottom sprocket to align things.

I tried a 1/16" thick machine washer behind the lower sprocket, and found that was no where near enough. An idea popped into my head, and I dug through my stuff, and found an NOS steel spacer for the lower shaft of a Fire series sled. For the most part, the Kioritz powered sleds used a 1" x 1" spacer on the driveshaft inside the chain case, but the Kawi powered sleds used a 1" x 1 1/16" one. I installed that, tried a number of variations, but in the end the closest to perfect was the 1 1/6" spacer with the 1/16" thick washer.

Now to install the sprockets into the case with the chain and tensioner installed. You know that anything with a spring is going to fight you! There is a tool to hold the tensioner open, but I lack that one. So, I turned a long 3/8" bolt into each shaft as an aid. I got the tensioner under the tin retainer, and got the top sprocket started on the shaft. I then removed the long bolt, and then installed the cap screw and washer just enough to keep things in place.

I had put a yellow dot on the lower sprocket where a spline valley was located, and a dot on the long bolt screwed in to the shaft showing where a spline point was located. I lined up the dots as best I could, then pushing down on the sprocket in the holes below the shaft opening I centered the long bolt in the hole as best I could, rocked the sprocket each way, and holy cow, it slid on!

I installed the cap screws for the last time with Loctite, tightened them up tight, and that was done. I cleaned up the sealing edge of the case, installed the gasket, cleaned the bolts and holes for the cover, gave them a bit of the Loctite, and installed the cover. One more thing off the list!
Attachments
thumbnail (63).jpg
thumbnail (62).jpg

'09 Vintage Challenge Survivor, and I wasn't late for supper!
'10, '11, '12, '13,'14,'15,'16,'17, '18, 19, 20, 21, 22 Vintage Challenge Survivor !
72 400 restored, Father bought new in '71
73 X8 restored
'74 340 green machine
'74 X8 9 time VC finisher
'78 Spitfire in progress
2 '75 340S 1 running, one on deck
'78 LF 440 future CC clone
'73 Skiroule RTX 440, 500 mi.
User avatar
400brian
Posts: 5626
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: James T. Kirk
Location: South Central Wisconsin

Re: Cyclones!!!

Post by 400brian »

I finally got the right hand side of the pan cleaned up, and smoothed out some slight dents.

I removed the bolts from the drag link, and put washers under the bolt heads. I do this on all my sleds, I don't know if it really does any good, but it makes me feel better that if the center of the eye fails, the whole thing does not. The bolt on the outside end of the drag link is probably going to hit the muffler. I didn't have a 1 1/4" bolt, so I will have to carefully cut that one flush with the steering arm.

The replacement tie rod was next, it got the same treatment, and all the fasteners discussed here got Loctite as well.

My brother suggested that I did indeed have the tool needed to compress the chain tightener in the chain case. I did a little looking, and I did. Oh well, next time I guess.
Attachments
thumbnail (64).jpg
thumbnail (65).jpg
thumbnail (67).jpg
thumbnail (66).jpg

'09 Vintage Challenge Survivor, and I wasn't late for supper!
'10, '11, '12, '13,'14,'15,'16,'17, '18, 19, 20, 21, 22 Vintage Challenge Survivor !
72 400 restored, Father bought new in '71
73 X8 restored
'74 340 green machine
'74 X8 9 time VC finisher
'78 Spitfire in progress
2 '75 340S 1 running, one on deck
'78 LF 440 future CC clone
'73 Skiroule RTX 440, 500 mi.
User avatar
400brian
Posts: 5626
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:00 am
Real Name: James T. Kirk
Location: South Central Wisconsin

Re: Cyclones!!!

Post by 400brian »

So in keeping with the idea that this sled is a rider, I have no plans to paint, other than perhaps a few touch ups. The problem is that if I paint everything up real nice, I might get the urge to clean and detail all of this stuff down the road, and I'm thinking a guy should nip that idea in the bud right now! I painted the ski springs because well, ski parts are always ratty, and rattle canning them isn't much more difficult than washing them.

So as I am getting ready to drop the engine back into the sled, it became apparent that the battery box that sits up high and proud was a little dull and a bit of rust was showing through. I had a can of Krylon black on hand, so the box got freshened up. It is not Blitz Black, but in this case it is close enough for the girls I date.

The hood hinge attach plate is pretty much the same deal, just too ratty to leave. The wire cup on the angle grinder made quick work of the clean up, but I decided to go full gonzo on this one and give it a good coat of primer first. So this will take a couple of days to finish.

The hood hinge will have to come off for the same treatment. When I was removing the hood I noticed that the hinge rivets were loose in the hood, so they will be removed and be replaced with 3/16" aircraft bolts. The hood on my 74 X8 was found to be loose on the hinges a number of years ago, a graphic reminder of the pounding the sled has taken on many Vintage Challenge rides. I repaired it with the the afore mentioned technique, and it has been fine since.
Attachments
thumbnail (76).jpg
thumbnail (78).jpg
thumbnail (77).jpg
thumbnail (75).jpg

'09 Vintage Challenge Survivor, and I wasn't late for supper!
'10, '11, '12, '13,'14,'15,'16,'17, '18, 19, 20, 21, 22 Vintage Challenge Survivor !
72 400 restored, Father bought new in '71
73 X8 restored
'74 340 green machine
'74 X8 9 time VC finisher
'78 Spitfire in progress
2 '75 340S 1 running, one on deck
'78 LF 440 future CC clone
'73 Skiroule RTX 440, 500 mi.
Post Reply