I am getting ready to assemble my 80 LF engine. I have a couple of questions...
What do you guys use for the gasket maker between the crank cases? I bought some of the "blue" perma tex silcone. Not sure if that will work or if another type would work better... such as the "black" silicone gasket maker??
My second question is about a C clip shaped shim. When taking the old crank out a C clip shaped shim/spacer fell out. Not sure where it came from. I bought a replacement crank that I will be installing. My question is do I need to install the spacer because the replacement crank did not come with one. If I need to install it....where does it go.
I can post pictures if there are any questions.
Any help would be appreciated!!
Thank,
Eric
Enginge Rebuild
Enginge Rebuild
Eric A.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid" - John Wayne
"Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid" - John Wayne
-
harleysportster
- Posts: 2965
- Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 12:00 am
- Real Name: Pat Scott
- Location: Southeast Pa.
Enginge Rebuild
I can't answer the question about the crank shims but do not use Permetex silicone sealer. There are special crankcase sealers such as Yama-bond,Kawa-bond , Three-Bond that should be used.
'76 440 cyclone
'76 440 liquifire
'78 440 Cyclone
'75 JDX8 (sold to a member here)
'78 Liquifire(CrossCountry Clone)
'80 Liquifire(sold)
'76 440 liquifire
'78 440 Cyclone
'75 JDX8 (sold to a member here)
'78 Liquifire(CrossCountry Clone)
'80 Liquifire(sold)
-
ICCSF 108
- Posts: 4369
- Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2005 12:00 am
- Real Name: Kenny Heins, AKA Grumpy
- Location: Blue Springs Mo.
- Contact:
Enginge Rebuild
:blink: This seems to have been said a lot lately, Hopefully you guy's will start to listen & believe what we are trying to tell you. You guy's need to Purchase a JD Service Manual for your Model JD Snowmobile to properly do an engine or Chassis rebuild. By asking questions on this JD Snowmobile Site might answer your specific question this time, BUT at some point something might not get asked or answered properly which could result in a waste of your time & for sure WILL mean a LOSS of YOUR money & a limited supply JD Snowmobile parts.
Spending a little $$ now will save you headaches & BIG $$$$$ down the road
Ken
Spending a little $$ now will save you headaches & BIG $$$$$ down the road
Ken
AKA: Kenny, Grumpy, Mr. Richard Head
"I Hunt For it, Purchase it, Haul it, Sometimes Repair it, Sometimes Break it, Then Fix it Again, Label it, Warehouse it, Talk About it, So NOW, HOW Can I Take Any Less $$ For It?"
"God I love the smell of KLOTZ in the morning, That smell, you know that Gasoline/Oil Smell, MAKES the whole place SMELL like.. LIKE VICTORY. You know someday the 2 strokers are gonna end..."
Do Anti-War Protesters have reunions? If so what do they TALK about?
"I Hunt For it, Purchase it, Haul it, Sometimes Repair it, Sometimes Break it, Then Fix it Again, Label it, Warehouse it, Talk About it, So NOW, HOW Can I Take Any Less $$ For It?"
"God I love the smell of KLOTZ in the morning, That smell, you know that Gasoline/Oil Smell, MAKES the whole place SMELL like.. LIKE VICTORY. You know someday the 2 strokers are gonna end..."
Do Anti-War Protesters have reunions? If so what do they TALK about?
Enginge Rebuild
Well I do have the all the manuals for the LF - parts/technical/owners.
But it does not mention what type of permatex to use or reference the shim that I have questions on. So I was hoping to get some input from some members who may have run into these issuses in the past.
Thanks,
Eric
But it does not mention what type of permatex to use or reference the shim that I have questions on. So I was hoping to get some input from some members who may have run into these issuses in the past.
Thanks,
Eric
Eric A.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid" - John Wayne
"Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid" - John Wayne
-
harleysportster
- Posts: 2965
- Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 12:00 am
- Real Name: Pat Scott
- Location: Southeast Pa.
Enginge Rebuild
Glad to here you have the manuals. I looked at the parts book and I can't tell where they go. Look for grooves cut into the crankcase for the shims. they actually hold the crank from shifting side to side.
'76 440 cyclone
'76 440 liquifire
'78 440 Cyclone
'75 JDX8 (sold to a member here)
'78 Liquifire(CrossCountry Clone)
'80 Liquifire(sold)
'76 440 liquifire
'78 440 Cyclone
'75 JDX8 (sold to a member here)
'78 Liquifire(CrossCountry Clone)
'80 Liquifire(sold)
-
ICCSF 108
- Posts: 4369
- Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2005 12:00 am
- Real Name: Kenny Heins, AKA Grumpy
- Location: Blue Springs Mo.
- Contact:
Enginge Rebuild
Eric, My mistake I had assumed that the 80-84 Liquifire service manual said what to use to seal the crank case halves together, the 76-78 one that I have says to use M64850 (silicone rubber adhesive) now I'm not sure what that exactly is, the best to use is what Harley said to use, also NAPA sells a product called Permatex Anaerobic Gasket Maker, (Item # 51813) but if you use this product you also need the can of Permatex Surface Prep (Item #765-1154 activator for Anaerobics) Whatever you use read the direction on the tube carefully, some want you to coat both halves some only want one side coated.
On Your second question, Like harley said there should be a groove in one of the crank halves that it fits in.
Glad you have the books alot of the guy's don't
Ken
On Your second question, Like harley said there should be a groove in one of the crank halves that it fits in.
Glad you have the books alot of the guy's don't
Ken
AKA: Kenny, Grumpy, Mr. Richard Head
"I Hunt For it, Purchase it, Haul it, Sometimes Repair it, Sometimes Break it, Then Fix it Again, Label it, Warehouse it, Talk About it, So NOW, HOW Can I Take Any Less $$ For It?"
"God I love the smell of KLOTZ in the morning, That smell, you know that Gasoline/Oil Smell, MAKES the whole place SMELL like.. LIKE VICTORY. You know someday the 2 strokers are gonna end..."
Do Anti-War Protesters have reunions? If so what do they TALK about?
"I Hunt For it, Purchase it, Haul it, Sometimes Repair it, Sometimes Break it, Then Fix it Again, Label it, Warehouse it, Talk About it, So NOW, HOW Can I Take Any Less $$ For It?"
"God I love the smell of KLOTZ in the morning, That smell, you know that Gasoline/Oil Smell, MAKES the whole place SMELL like.. LIKE VICTORY. You know someday the 2 strokers are gonna end..."
Do Anti-War Protesters have reunions? If so what do they TALK about?
Enginge Rebuild
Hey thanks for the input.
I think I figured out where that shim goes. I started the assembly tonight. So far so good. Hopefully have some time tomorrow night to make some more progress.
-Eric
I think I figured out where that shim goes. I started the assembly tonight. So far so good. Hopefully have some time tomorrow night to make some more progress.
-Eric
Eric A.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid" - John Wayne
"Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid" - John Wayne
Enginge Rebuild
before you install the shim the crank endplay has to be determined. depending on the ammount of endplay you may need shims with different thickness. use yamabond to seal the crankcase mating surfaces. silicone gasket maker wont work for this application. the formulation is the same for all colors blue for old chevy, black for later mopars, white for bathtubs etc etc.
-
400brian
- Posts: 5623
- Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:00 am
- Real Name: James T. Kirk
- Location: South Central Wisconsin
Enginge Rebuild
OK, so I go into my Yamaha dealer, and he has 4 different types of Yamabond on the shelf! I ask him which is the one for sealing cases, and he gives me the product brochure, that just re-states what it says on the packaging.
One is for sticking your handle bar grips on, don't want that.
But the other three aren't all that different in description.
I took home number 4, but I'm still not sure if it is the correct product.
Anyone know for sure?
One is for sticking your handle bar grips on, don't want that.
But the other three aren't all that different in description.
I took home number 4, but I'm still not sure if it is the correct product.
Anyone know for sure?
'09 Vintage Challenge Survivor, and I wasn't late for supper!
'10, '11, '12, '13,'14,'15,'16,'17, '18, 19, 20, 21, 22 Vintage Challenge Survivor !
72 400 restored, Father bought new in '71
73 X8 restored
'74 340 green machine
'74 X8 9 time VC finisher
'78 Spitfire in progress
2 '75 340S 1 running, one on deck
'78 LF 440 future CC clone
'73 Skiroule RTX 440, 500 mi.
Enginge Rebuild
Crankcase sealer: Many people say not to use an automotive silicone sealer as gasoline will eventually cause it to lose its bond and seal. I believe that to be true. The automotive applications are usually for oil pans, valve covers...oil and glycol/water sealing. The JD Tech Manual, leastwise for the fire series Liquifire, says use "M64850 Silicon Rubber Adhesive". One local dealer had one tube of it, $39 for 2.8 oz!! Parts man could not tell me how old his stock was or what it was for, he just knew he one tube of it via his computer. Pretty pricey stuff assuming the dealer had it priced right. Went thru my Arctic Cat mid 1980's to early 1990's manuals and their pictures showed Three Bond 1104. That stuff sells for about $5 for 3.5 oz. That is what I used.......so far so good. 3.5 oz is more than enough for several engine rebuilds including a light coating on water gaskets, jugs to crankcase gaskets, etc.
To complicate the matter, there is also a Three Bond 1211. Some aftermarket sled houses sell one or the other or both. I could not figure out which to use by going to the Three Bond web site which lists some 50 other of their products to boot.......so I went with the Cat manual. Also if you google Three Bond a lot of cycle shops show up as selling 1104. Somewhere along that search the 1104 was recommended for gasoline and oil but that was not readily apparent from the offical Three Bond site. Also, if I remember right, the 1211 is for larger gap sealing??
Maybe Rich can set us straight on this subject?
To complicate the matter, there is also a Three Bond 1211. Some aftermarket sled houses sell one or the other or both. I could not figure out which to use by going to the Three Bond web site which lists some 50 other of their products to boot.......so I went with the Cat manual. Also if you google Three Bond a lot of cycle shops show up as selling 1104. Somewhere along that search the 1104 was recommended for gasoline and oil but that was not readily apparent from the offical Three Bond site. Also, if I remember right, the 1211 is for larger gap sealing??
Maybe Rich can set us straight on this subject?
Enginge Rebuild
Yikes!!! The price went up another 77 cents 
Enginge Rebuild
When I was replacing end seals on my Sportfire I went through this same dilema. I went to a marine engine rebuilder and he pulled out a Loctite product and said he only uses it on engine cases. Loctite 515 (part no. 51531), flange sealant. At the time I thought it was pricey, but it did not matter if it would prevent any issues in the future. About 1000 miles and no issues. Finding someone who sells it may take a little searching.
Mark
Mark