KEC 440/22

Docjim · Post by **Docjim** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:13 am

I am helping out a friend that has one of these in a cyclone. Is there any manuals online about this engine? Who makes it and what are the good and bad points? Maybe some hints on what to look out for. Thanks Everyone. <_<

Post by **ICCSF 108** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:31 am

Docjim, Welcome to the John Deere board, The Motor is a Kiortz/CCW Made in Japan.
You can still purchase Service manuals from John Deere from there Web site for the Cyclones or from Ebay, I would recommend that, as JD service manuals are very helpful & detailed. These motors were very reliable & trouble free, other than is not stored properly over the years & a long period of time, like any snowmobile motor you have gummed up a carb, possible outer seal problems, or a CDI box going bad.
What exactly is the problem your having? I guess we need more info.....

Kenny

Docjim · Post by **Docjim** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 1:43 pm

Thanks for the welcome!

No problem really. I am just not experienced with these and thought I would ask the JD experts about it. Seems like a nice sled. Should be very stable. Thinking about how to get rid of the cleated track but needed to more about the engine before we decided to use it. Thanks for the help. Doc

Post by **ICCSF 108** » Wed Oct 17, 2007 3:32 pm

Docjim, I'm Not sure what year your working with, & I know that I'll probably get a few guys to disagree on this one, but by using a 80-84 Liquifire or 82-84 Sportfire track & suspension you would get the rubber track (although a little shorter --- 121" on the Cyclones Std & the newer Yokohama rubber tracks were 116" think) but still would have the 3.29 pitch track, bad part is I think you have to relocate the suspension mounting holes. I'm not that up on the cyclones

Kenny

Rodimus Prime · Post by **Rodimus Prime** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 4:20 am

the cleated tracks are also not 3.29 pitch but usually 2.52 pitch.

the bad about engine reed valves sometimes go bad check them to see if not stuck open or rusted.

stinger440 · Post by **stinger440** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 8:17 am

If the reeds are bad a set of Boysen reeds from an early 80's suzuki RM 80 will fit right in. Use 92 octane fuel. Don't ask how I learned that lesson. Check the plugs after running it, on mine the PTO side tends to run hotter than the mag side.

Docjim · Post by **Docjim** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 11:35 am

Thanks for the help but we are not looking for a speed sled just something that is dependable and runs good for a rider. Still dont know what to do about the cleated track. Maybe the Sportfire idea could come to life. Thanks again.

400brian · Post by **400brian** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 2:47 pm

Doc, what is your objection to the cleated track?

If it has a 2/3 cleated track you have no problem. I don't know if you can say they are bullet proof, but they seem to be low maintenance.

Try it before you go to a bunch of work changing things.

Docjim · Post by **Docjim** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 4:15 pm

I know I am going out on a limb here but back in the 70's I was running cleated tracks on the Polaris sleds. I got very mad that they kept breaking cleats all the time. Arctic didnt have the cleat breaking problem with the 3/4 cleat. So I fit one under the old TX. Lost about 8 MPH and could never get it back. Then I talked to some racers in Alexandria and told them the situation and they said to lift the sled of the ground and let it have it. Get the track turning at high speeds and take a look. What I saw was exactly what they told me would happen. The inside of the track would expand to a much greater degree than the outside. This is because there is more weight in the center of the track than to the outsides. The imbalance cost me high end MPH. I then fit a rubber track from a TXL in it and solved al the problems. I was much more into going fast back then than I am now. I also believe the 3/4 cleats would be great in a rider situation. This just all left a bad taste in my mouth for 3/4 cleats.

Incedently, a good freind of mine had some of these cats and we did the same to his sled and he picked up some serious MPH.

I think the rubber tracks last longer and ride better. Maybe could be wrong with the Deere's but I know this is true to Polaris.

harleysportster · Post by **harleysportster** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 6:02 pm

Kenny,
I have a 76 cyclone and 76 liquifire that have the 2/3 track upgrade. The original full cleat track was replaced under warranty back in the day. I have not any problems with either track other than replacing cleats that were rusted thru. The key to anything old is a general inspection/maintainence program and replace cleats BEFORE they break. The original full cleated track had bonded cleats, the 2/3 track has revited cleats. The bonded cleats did not hold up and came loose. With these vintage machines you are not going to notice any horse power gain or MPH without testing on a sled dyno.
Keep it original and in the long run it will be easier to maintain.

Docjim · Post by **Docjim** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 7:35 pm

Well it dont look good for the home team. The piston is shot head is peened and cylinder on the PTO looks bad. Where do you get parts for this old girl. Would really like to get it running

400brian · Post by **400brian** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 7:41 pm

There are a set of sleeves on ebay now. Otherwise, MN Vintage Snowmobile.
Banner at top of page.

harleysportster · Post by **harleysportster** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 7:41 pm

Contact Mn Vintage Snowmobile, sponsor of this site or contact TakeItToTheLimit(member from this site)

Docjim · Post by **Docjim** » Thu Oct 18, 2007 9:32 pm

Thanks. I will see what they have.

JoeRainville · Post by **JoeRainville** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 9:33 pm

Hi Doc,

There is a 121" Cat rubber track that actually fits the first Gen Liquifire / Cyclone with only a drive axle and sprocket ass'y swap. It has the same side rail and sprocket center distances, but uses a 3.29" pitch instead of the original 2.52 pitch.

Kenny Hiens is right about the 80 LF swap. It works, but I hate it. You end up with a 5" shorter track and it looks goofy.

Also, drop me a line at home if you can't find parts for your Cyclone. I have some of that stuff, somewhere in my barn.

-Joe Rainville
joerainville@hotmail.com