building a small groomer puller

Post by **ICCSF 108** » Sun Apr 13, 2008 12:32 am

I wonder if driving off the center or near center of the track drive shaft might not be a better Idea as pulling off one side might put a lot of stress on the track drive shaft being that the track are so far apart ???
just thinking out loud!!!

I have a question for you engineer types, which takes more HP or is more efficient???
Pulling a track ( Like a caterpillar drivers in the back ) or pushing a track ( like a snowmobile does, drivers in the front )???? Or doesn't it make any difference??
Kenny

Liquifire 4/6 · Post by **Liquifire 4/6** » Sun Apr 13, 2008 10:38 am

ICCSF 108 wrote: I wonder if driving off the center or near center of the track drive shaft might not be a better Idea as pulling off one side might put a lot of stress on the track drive shaft being that the track are so far apart ???

My original plan was to drive it from the center, but I changed to an end drive for a few reasons:

1) A center drive would have required that I place my tranny and engine to the RH side of the center line which I felt might result in some degree of tippiness.
2) I wanted some nice clutter free floor area in the cab and a center drive would have meant having a chaincase occupying space there.
3) Servicing the sprockets and chain in a center drive would have been much more difficult as I'd need to pull the tracks just to change a sprocket
4) Building a chaincase to accomodate a center drive would have been more complex since both the top and bottom shafts would have to run completely thru it and sealing the oil in might be tough.

The shaft is a high grade 1 1/8" with 5 bearings and I don't think it should ever break, bend, or twist. The reason I'm using JD track drive sprockets is that it's the largest diameter snowmobile drive set up I could find and I didn't want the shaft to be a weak spot. The only downside to the outboard mounted chaincase I can see is that it needs to be really tough (read heavy) because it's bound to encounter the occaissional rub with a tree. The chaincase will be a 3" x 6" heavy wall rectangle approx 14" in height and will probably weigh 20 pounds or so. And my biggest problem on this machine is going to be keeping the weight down to a minimum. I really wish I knew something about engineering as I tend to overbuild because I don't know how strong, is strong enough.

Post by **ICCSF 108** » Sun Apr 13, 2008 12:50 pm

Pete, if you ever need a bigger shaft I have about 90 NOS Track Drive Sprockets for the 77 Scorpion Bull Whip's, with a Hole size 1.375 Hex, 14 Tooth, 3:29 Pitch, I had these repopped a few years ago.
I know what you mean about making things too heavy to get strength.....
Kenny

Liquifire 4/6 · Post by **Liquifire 4/6** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:55 pm

I didn't realize the Bull Whips had a 1 3/8" shaft. It wouldn't work for me though because I don't think there was ever a 3.29" pitch track longer than about 120" and I need all of the length these SKS tracks have in order to support the weight of this thing.

_FIII · Post by **_FIII** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:37 pm

I think you should be ok with the steering Pete. I know the ski-doo elite turns fairly well and they have the skis pretty close to the tracks. Not al ot of ski pressure on them either. If you had decided to go the route of a center drive, a wrecked alpine would have been your best bet. They are the same as the elite but have the addition of a low range. I changed out the tracks on a friends elite this winter and it was far easier than I ever expected. I would bet that I could change out those two tracks in two thirds of the time that a conventional sled could. They use two stock doo drive shafts and the right one is put in backwards, with the splines on the left. Each drive shaft is inserted halfway into the the drive gear. Very slick. Two guys could easily change both tracks on an alpine or elite in two hours. Good luck with the project!

basketdators · Post by **basketdators** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 12:34 am

Hey Mole, looks like it might be a real bugger getting the lawn mower on though!
I wonder what class it would be in Vintage Drags. Great hole shot I bet

Liquifire 4/6 · Post by **Liquifire 4/6** » Wed Apr 16, 2008 12:06 pm

basketdators wrote: Hey Mole, looks like it might be a real bugger getting the lawn mower on though!
I wonder what class it would be in Vintage Drags. Great hole shot I bet

Hey no problem. I think I'm gonna spread plastic over my lawn and cover the whole darn yard with gravel anyways. Ya think they'd let me run this thing at the Govan drags? Wonder if they'd allow me a handicap like in golf? Maybe I could run against Al's grandkids on those Kitty Cats......I'd of course let them win again like I did that time with the Sno Runner ( Al told me afterward I should never use my brakelight in a drag race). What am I saying? They'd probably smoke me without even trying.

Liquifire 4/6 · Post by **Liquifire 4/6** » Sat Apr 19, 2008 11:50 pm

This is going slower than I had anticipated, but the bulkhead and front suspension is finally attached.

Spitfireguy · Post by **Spitfireguy** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:47 pm

That is just goign alone really nice. i cant wait to see the end result

Mr. Deere · Post by **Mr. Deere** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 5:40 pm

Hey Pete it looks good. Hey its pretty hard to see I think you need a little bit more light. BOB

Jack Frost · Post by **Jack Frost** » Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:06 pm

Pete take a look at this machine for sale near my place! Never even heard of one of these before. Seems to be along the line of what you want to build. Very neat looking.

Dave

Kijiji

S_Kyle · Post by **S_Kyle** » Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:56 pm

That's quite a unit.

Liquifire 4/6 · Post by **Liquifire 4/6** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 12:17 am

I finally had a few spare hours today to get back to tinkering on this rig. I sorta got the front suspension and steering linkage figured out, except for mounting a steering box. Originally, I had planned to use an electric actuator to steer it, but I got to thinking that would make it a little to touchy to keep it between the trees. I stripped a 1964 John deere 110 lawn tractor awhile back and it has a real nifty steering box which I am hoping to utilize once I get new bearings for it. It seems to have nice reduction and I found a steering double U-joint shaft from a smaller Oldsmobile which I think I can use to tie the steering box to the sterring wheel....I might even be able to rig up a tilt column which would be pretty sweet.

Attachments:

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Liquifire 4/6 · Post by **Liquifire 4/6** » Sun Jul 20, 2008 3:58 pm

This thing is burnin up all my spare time..... and then some, but I feel like I'm finally starting to make some headway. I'm still shooting some ideas around my head about how to construct the cab...hopefully will have the basic structure in place within a couple weeks. Here's a current pic of how it looks. Sorry about the dark pic....I towed it outside today and got some better pics, but they are all around 400KB and too large to post in here.

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Jack Frost · Post by **Jack Frost** » Sun Jul 20, 2008 5:31 pm

That is some nice work you have done Pete!

Keep the updates coming.

Dave