TR800 Driven Clutch info needed

[Liquifire 4/6]

I am in the process of re-powering a 78 Cyclone with an Indy Trail engine and Polaris primary. I would have liked to also have used the Polaris driven clutch because it is already set up for the 1 3/8" wide drive belt, but the Deere 7/8" diameter jackshaft makes that difficult to accomplish.
But I recall that the later 82-84 Liquifires that had the TR800 clutches did use a 1 3/8" wide belt. So what are the differences between the driven clutches on the 80/81 Liquifires versus the 82/84 Liquifires? Is the outside diameter the same? Or is it essentially the same driven clutch with just some sort of belt spacers installed?

I bought this 78 Cyclone last winter from a guy who had taken it to his buddy's place to have the engine rebuilt. His pal had removed the engine from the sled and dragged the sled outside to make more space in his shop. The Kioritz was sitting on his work bench ready to be torn down when the shop caught fire and burned to the ground. I probably could eventually locate an original engine however I just happen to have a nice 488 Indy Trail engine that I completely rebuilt back in 2001 and it's about time I installed it in something.

[AirborneX4Special]

The Liquifire secondary used with the TR 800 has longer towers to accommodate the wider belt along with a different helix and spring. I don't think the diameter is different but I've also never taken that measurement. In addition, the jackshaft was changed to accommodate the increased travel requirements and was supposedly strengthened 20%.

[Liquifire 4/6]

Thanks for the information, Pat. My next question then would be.....does anyone have a driven clutch for a TR800 set-up available for sale? I know I had one kicking around for eons but I have searched everywhere for it and I am starting to think I might have given it away a couple of winters ago.

[sledhead16]

I thought the helix and spring were the same when I've had them all apart. I can tell you none of the parts numbers are accurate to the ones on the actual parts. The sheaves are the same diameter but the towers are an 1/8th" taller on the tr800 compatible drivens.

[AirborneX4Special]

When in doubt, consult the parts book:
Helix is different
Spring is the same

I agree that actual parts tend to differ from what is listed in the parts reference. Helix or "cam" as Deere calls it in the parts book is noted as a 44 degree piece 82 - 84 but not specified 80 - 81.

[Liquifire 4/6]

Thanks again for all the help, fellows. I may have tracked down a TR800 driven clutch but I am not 100 % certain of that yet. A buddy sent me a pic of a 1980 Liquifire that he is wanting to sell or part out. The pictures he sent me clearly show a TR800 drive clutch on the engine. But he said it didn't even have a belt on it when he got it and one has to wonder if the sled received the proper TR800 driven clutch when the drive clutch was installed. I should be seeing the sled with a week and if I am positive the driven is a TR800 style, I'll probably buy the entire sled.

One question though, when you say the towers are taller on the TR800 driven clutch, do you mean the three threaded tubular towers on which the helix (cam) bolts onto? Or are you referring to the standoffs on the moveable sheave on which the plastic buttons mount to?

[AirborneX4Special]

The "towers" are indeed the fixtures you describe. They're longer so as to accommodate the wider belt on 82 - 84 machines, but a TR 800 could have been retrofitted to the 80 LF you're thinking of owning without switching the driven clutch. The stock 102-C from the 80/81 Liquifires was never durable enough to tolerate the power of that engine on a long term basis. Given the Kentucky Windage involved with the parts nomenclature it might be difficult to determine which secondary is on that sled. It would operate just fine using the OEM secondary in conjunction with the TR, especially if fine tuning was the last thing the owner considered.

[JDXspec]

Another idea since you mentioned you would like to use a polaris secondary. Find a jackshaft from a mid 80s Arctic cat Elitgre. The shaft is 1" at the secondary clutch and bolts into a jd chaincase perfectly. The only mod needed is the key is wider in the AC shaft for the brake disc. Machine the key down or widen the keyway in the jd brake disc. I have done this twice in my jds and it works good. I used A/C roller secondary clutches in mine

[sledhead16]

The reason I say the helix are the same is even if you look at different parts that are identical but used on different deere models, they are given different part numbers, why they do that I can't explain even when they are identical....hahaha. I would like to use a p85 indy 400 or indy trail primary with a 82-84 liquifire driven and the Polaris 1 3/8" belt....but I've never measured up center to center clutch distance to see if it would work.

[JDGuy]

Another idea since you mentioned you would like to use a polaris secondary. Find a jackshaft from a mid 80s Arctic cat Elitgre. The shaft is 1" at the secondary clutch and bolts into a jd chaincase perfectly. The only mod needed is the key is wider in the AC shaft for the brake disc. Machine the key down or widen the keyway in the jd brake disc. I have done this twice in my jds and it works good. I used A/C roller secondary clutches in mine

Your setup is intriguing, especially the roller Cat clutch. What primary and belt width have you been using? A 108? I put an aftermarket roller clutch conversion on an 92 Cat EXT and the performance increase was far more than expected, both back shift and top end, the top end was unexpected. My 80LF could use a similar increase. I would really like to hear of your experience should you feel free to share it.

Thanks,
Guy

[Jd sled rider]

I have a team secondary on an 83 liquifire with a tr 800. I also have a team secondary on a 78 liquifire with a 102 c shimmed for the 1 3/8 belt. I would load a pic of Th 83 but I forgot how to resize it!

[JDXspec]

my setup is in my liquidator clone. i retained the factory offset and c to c dimensions for the 76 Liquifire its built off of. Has a 650 wildcat eng with 108 primary. I did the RWTC poker run and swamp challenge this yr with no problems. Apparently i haven't taken any pics since i installed the roller secondary. This is a pic with the jd secondary shimmed for the 1 3/8" belt.

[Liquifire 4/6]

Again, thanks to everyone for all the tips and I love your Dator clone, JDXspec.
I got the Liquifire today and it does have a TR800 driven clutch with the taller towers so I will use that in conjunction with a Polaris P85 primary and a 1 3/8" belt. I was seriously thinking about going the Cat jackshaft route if my search for the JD TR800 driven didn't pan out.

[JoeRainville]

Hi guys,

Just to clarify a few if the questions, all 1980-84 Liquifire's use a 44 deg helix. The 80-81 helix is 44 deg, PN AM55070. The 82-84 44 deg helix used the nicer snap in 'Duralon" nylon bushing instead of the older press in bushing. The tower height seems to be the only difference from the earlier driven, aside from said helix bushing.

I hope this helps,
-Joe

[Liquifire 4/6]

The TR800 style driven I got looks in fantastic condition. I noticed that the spacer shim behind the helix is missing and am wondering how important those spacers are. The fine tune manual states they are there to prevent the belt coming out of the drive clutch if the belt is too long or center to center distance is too short. I do recall that the early 80s Liquifires I had did have those spacers in behind the helixes but I've seen lots of JD drivens that didn't have them and none of those ever had any belt issues that I am aware of. I suppose I should make a spacer to be on the safe side.