Spindle bushings

ralphy · Post by **ralphy** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 12:45 pm

Good morning. A month or so ago, I replaced the spindle bushings in the LF. I installed them as the parts diagram shows, never seized the heck outta them. After 300 odd miles, there is major play side to side again on the left side bushings, right side is still tight. This cant be normal. I cant think of anything that would cause such rapid wear. The bulkhead seems untouched & straight, but I dont know the history, so who knows. Thanks for looking..

pj sportfire · Post by **pj sportfire** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 12:56 pm

What are the factory (or aftermarket) bushings made of? We have the ability to machine whatever a guys wants here at the shop and if you think it's worth the effort, we can look into machining new replacement bushings made of T-304 stainless steel that could even have radial grooves cut into the I'D. of them to hold grease.

Just trying to help if I can..

pj

ralphy · Post by **ralphy** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 1:02 pm

Honestly, I dont know. Im sure others do. It seems to be a combination of copper, aluminum, etc. Im guessing the little excess tolerance of the actual spindle wearing has caused some "hammering" of the new bushings. I might have to have the spindles turned down to get them true, and have a bushing made. I think the bushing would still have to be softer than the steel spindles, so the spindles dont wear vs the bushings.

pj sportfire · Post by **pj sportfire** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 1:27 pm

Makes sense. I wonder if they are sintered bronze or the like?

Oil Filled Bronze has a PV of 50,000 and retains it's lubricant longer due to it's porosity, than what "dry" cast bronze does- making it wear exceptionally well with little maintainence. Cast Bronze 660 has a PV of 75,000 and is pretty hard for being bronze due to less porosity- which makes it last longer than oil filled does, but then it takes more maintainence to keep the stuff greased up or it will go dry and gall/squeek.

We've used some of the 660 stuff to machine HD bronze lifter bore bushings for auto engines that are constantly bathed in fresh engine oil when running.

I'd guess the oil filled bronze would probably be pretty good balance of wearability vs. maintainence for a sled that sees that much snow/ice in the ski area. Not certain though and maybe someone else can chime in that knows what the stock stuff is made of?

pj

ChickenRat · Post by **ChickenRat** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 1:50 pm

You need to go through the whole front end. I just went through an '84 Sportfire that had a really sloppy front end. The spindle bushings in the chassis are usually not worn out(however, the have a tendency to spin in the chassis. What I do is take a punch and tap the punch around the inside of the chassis and when you put the spindle bushing back in, it won't turn). Tie rod ends are a must. The spindle bushings that connect to the leaf springs are usually rusted solid. Those need to be freed up and replaced/greased. Also check your mounting holes on the leaf springs themselves. If the spindle bushing was frozen, the bolt hole is probably ovaled like mine were. Also, check the leaf springs themselves. they can be loose as well like mine were. If the plastic saddle bushings are missing or worn, you'll get more slop there as well. It's a combination thing. Every little bit helps. If you do the whole front end, you'll be amazed at the difference. My '84 Sport front end is now as tight as new.

Robb

Spitfire79 · Post by **Spitfire79** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 5:07 pm

Where can we get the bushings, spindles, etc. Available aftermarket? Mine need doing

Jeff

ralphy · Post by **ralphy** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 6:07 pm

I see the bushings are moving inside the tubes. The ski saddle bushings are also new.I had to drill the saddle bushings & skis to fit a bigger bolt. That tightened that end of it. My tie rod ends need replacing as does the spring end pins. My ski sliders are good yet. I will have to get the spindle bushings to stop moving around in the tubes. thanks

ChickenRat · Post by **ChickenRat** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 6:44 pm

Like I said with the bushings inside the chassis. If you take a point punch and go around the inside circumference of the chassis, you'll create dimples inside the hole, then when you put the bushing back inside, it won't turn on you anymore it'll bind on your punch points. I've done this on a few sleds and have scribed a mark to see if the bushing spins and so far they haven't. Tie rods make a big difference in the front end.

Try Bob at Image Enterprises for the actual bushings. Dennis Kirk Scratch and Dent used to have a ton of these and they still may. Give them a call as well.

Robb

Jack Frost · Post by **Jack Frost** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 7:25 pm

ralphy wrote:Good morning. A month or so ago, I replaced the spindle bushings in the LF. I installed them as the parts diagram shows, never seized the heck outta them.

I would not use never seize on them as it has metal particles in it and will wear moveable parts. Just use a good low temp grease or even install a grase fitting and service them when needed

Just my 2 cents.

Dave

ralphy · Post by **ralphy** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 8:57 pm

it was a mixture of never seize & low temp wheel bearing grease. I will have to try the punch method. thanks much

JDT · Post by **JDT** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 10:04 pm

Bushings and tie-rod ends are stocked by MCM.

Spitfire79 · Post by **Spitfire79** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:11 pm

MCM? I'm in Manitoba, never heard of them

Jeff

JDT · Post by **JDT** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 10:04 am

www.mcmaster.com

JDDDeere · Post by **JDDDeere** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 10:02 am

Copied this from a previosu post I made. I had significant slop and was missing (entierly) the lower spindle/flange bushing. Todd connected me to mcmaster and I got what I needed .. there is wide variety of materials but the dimensions of some of the materials does limited selection. Search the forum on "sloppy skis" and you will see the entire post. IN summary this was relativley easy to do and not particularly expensive. The steering on my sprintfire (granted only 30 miles since replacement) is still very tight and I am very, very glad that I did this.

Good luck

___________________

JUst to close the book on this...

I installed all the parts (bushings). I think it worked fine. I elected to go with the Nylon flanged bushing on the bottom (these are the ones that come 5 per pack for like $7) where before I had none! They are 1 1/4 inch long but had no problems inserting. As a back up I have a pair of bronze bushings. I used the orig plastic bushing on the top of the spindles as they were still very tight.

As for the ski pivot bushig, agian I used two 1-inch bushings, ground one down a smidge to give exact lengthof old bearing/bushing. Oiled up and inserted. I am intrigued by the Steel tubing offered by WIcks (in Brians post.. that is a very affordable/easy option for steel).

Replaced skis with new bolts.. and wha la... have no more than 1/2 inch of play at the ski tips... can't wait to try but we just lost all our snow!!!!

Also, an aligning tip: I aligned the spindles using a 3/8 in wooden dowel which I inserted thru both pivot bushings when the skis were off.

Thanks for the ideas and help.

(now if anyone has any hood decals or an old speedo cable, that is all I am missing)

Dan

Post by **ICCSF 108** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 10:18 am

I guess I haven't followed this & confess to not reading it all, But does McMasters Sell the plastic or bronze or steel spindle bushings? I've seen that the plastic ones on the Snowfires & the Sprintfires wear very fast & then wear into the aluminum spindle housing which causes a whole other problem..

Kenny