Deeres are better

JD340S · Post by **JD340S** » Wed Jan 28, 2009 7:42 am

Always in these conversations the price of new sleds comes up as being to much $$$$$$$. Snowmobiles were always to much $$$$$$$$$. 84 Liquifire.......list $4399. Or if you find a calculator online to compensate for yesterdays prices you'll find out that your beloved vintage sleds cost more then than a comparable sled today. The beaters you find on Craigslist for $200 were also new at one time with some kid crying the couldn't afford one. Right now is one of the best times to by a new sled. They are considered leftovers & dealers don't want to end up paying floor plan on them. 09 Ski Doo TnT 500ss can be had for $6900 with Estart. TnT 1200 4stroke list for $10,199.......can be had for $2000+ off list. Either that look for a 4-7 yr old creampuff in the $2500-$3500 range

Mr. Deere · Post by **Mr. Deere** » Wed Jan 28, 2009 11:28 am

I think its kinda cool in the rear skid set up. I agree though it would be only fun in snow cross or even mountain climbs. I think it posses a concern about the track being that exposed. I work with a guy who lost his leg to a sled track.

Post by **guitardude081** » Wed Jan 28, 2009 12:22 pm

This looks to me like a trail sled. Notice the production style (Now 10 seasons old) throttle/brake blocks, and the digital gauge. The race sleds don't have these features. The only qualm I have with the IQ as a trail sled is that after a long day of riding when you want to sit down, you get violated my a narrow seat. We had a few guys at the X-games where they debuted it. They said that the skid looked too soft. It may be cushy, but who knows, it may work. Remember the old '93 formula when it came out. They made low production numbers and everyone had to have one the next year. If the Rush works, new sled buyers will want to give it a try. The basic slide suspension setup is 30+ years old now, it's time for something new. My only thought on the rush is...... how do they keep snow on the exchangers? Right now for '09 I'd say the best new sled award goes to the Rev-XP or the Cat Sno-Pro chassis. Both are flat chassis' and both 600 engines have plenty of power. This is coming from a Polaris die-hard.
~Jack

Post by **dator** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 1:36 am

Most new sled designs these days are a direct result,from the snocross racing.Ski-doo
came out with the rider forward Rev in 03,Blair Morgan was almost unbeatable for 2-3
years.Then Polaris and Cat started to catch up.Now everybody is rider forward.It seamed
like cross country trail sleds were left behind in development.But after spending a weekend
with the I-500 racers,and a little tweeking here and there,these sleds are awesome trail
sleds and ditch bangers.
I think the sled companies are on the verge of some new and wild designs in near future,
and the Polaris Rush is one of many to come.

JDFanPa · Post by **JDFanPa** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 1:48 am

I was at a dealer tonight who sells all 4 brands and I hate the style of them all. I love my deeres but having 1 or 2 newer sleds has been something I like also. Right now my newest is a 97 cat and dont plan on owning anything much newer than an 03. I think polaris made some that still look like a snowmobile until 05ish. Whats with the air shocks on the front ends of these sleds how long can they hold up.

cosmo440 · Post by **cosmo440** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 2:21 am

What kind of dealer is this that sells all 4 brands? I know Yamaha and Cat sell together, but as far as I know Polaris only sells Polaris sleds. The air shocks are basically lighter because you don't need the coil spring on it. Durability is the same as all other quality rebuildable shocks, there is just air inside. These shocks have been in the industry for a few years now. Getting back to the Rush, traditional sleds are a thing of the past now. Have you seen some of the concepts for the automotive industry? Change is everywhere. Some is good, some is bad, but in the end we have to accept it. I would love to see a reproduction made of some of the early sleds, with todays tech in it. Imagine a Liquifire with IFS(modern, not the trailing arm that some people have hacked onto it), 136x15x1.25" track, fully coupled rear skid, and a wicked 600 twin all wraped in a black hood with the same lines as an 80-84. All we can do is keep the old alive by continuing to rebuild and restore the past.

69camaro · Post by **69camaro** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 11:19 am

There is a dealer that sells "all" four brands in Wisconsin. I stopped at the local Polaris dealer yesterday for a small part and they had brochures on the new Rush. He said it sparked a lot of interest but there was a lot of negative feedback about the sled. Mostly as what I have already stated. He said the younger croud was very interested and also stated most in their 30's and above gave it a thumbs down. His son who is in his 20's loved it. The dealer is 50ish and told me he was going to go through his 2005 XC600 again for next season. I am not against technology at all. It is a bold design and perhaps the future in rear suspension technology. From what I saw in the brochure it could have been made to be a lot easier on the eyes. Duane

JoeRainville · Post by **JoeRainville** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 3:42 pm

Hi Guys,

First off I will admit that I only own 440cc late model SnoCross sleds, a 99 and 02 Cat Fans Sno Pro's and a pair of 05 Liquids, one trail converted, the other in race trim. These share a barn and trailer with 30 odd Deere sleds, and a few Cross Country Cats.

Every time an advanced new sled comes out, someone immediately post a pic about, and writes how ugly it is. The 02 Cat 440 "ZR" Sno Pro was the first of the "Firecat" line up that was introduced in 2003. Everyone ripped on it, but the racer was scary fast and light wieght. The F-7 was a very, very good seller for Cat and even took the single model sales records for a few years.

The point is that you can't judge a sled by its looks until you through a leg over it. What if this Polaris has 20" of rear travel, rides as nice as a touring sled, but never bottoms in mogals? Maybe it outhandles everything else Polaris builds? What if it weights under 400 lbs? I am not saying I love the look, but the Yami Phazer is quite popular with it's "Gen Y" styling, or lack there of.

Who thought the REV was attrative when Blair was racing it in open mod in 2002? That same chassis rocketed Ski-Doo to #1 in sales, blowing past Polaris and there "classic" designs and cheap "sport" sleds.

As for air shocks, both my 05's have them. It takes 4 lbs off the front end, and they don't give that wrist crushing jolt when landing from big jumps. You can reduce the air presure to change the ride in just a few minutes.

All I am suggesting is that you reserve judgement until you get a feel for these new generation sleds...and then vote with your dollars.

-Rainville

69camaro · Post by **69camaro** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 4:40 pm

Actually Joe I thought the Firecat was a very nice looking sled from day one. It still had enough characteristics to be a wonderful trail machine. I have looked at the newest Firecats and they look to be excellent trail machines. The new Arctic Cat sno-crosser is also easy on the eyes and looks like it could be a nice trail machine given a seat with storage like the new F-series. It also looks like a taller windshield for trail riding looks tasteful unlike the other brands. I guess I just said it. After owning Polaris for 21 years I will eventually be switching to Arctic Cat. For what I want in a trail machine they truely deserve my business. Duane

JDT · Post by **JDT** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 8:11 pm

hey Joe, when you say CC cats are you talking about the 76-79 ones?

JoeRainville · Post by **JoeRainville** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 9:40 pm

Duane,

Yea, I have to admit I really like the down to business look of the new Cat 600 Sno Pro racers. I will give Polaris credit, there 05 440 was every bit as good as my Cat. Yea, I thought it was goofy looking, but it was a tough competitor. I will also admit I really like last years Ski-Doo racer too, and that new TnT, but after Deere went out in 84, I kind of became a Cat guy.

Todd,

Yea, I have a few of the 79 Cross Country Cats. They are really the only non-Deere vintage sled I want to collect, cross country racers that is, and Cats in peticular. I have a beat 79 CC Cat with the 340cc kit and another one that is a 440 as a parts sled. The best one is 79 IFS CC racer, 1 of 2 I found out in the last issue of Cat's Pride.

As much as I try to keep my collection all Deere, it's hard because there are so many other cool vintage sleds. My first sled was a 69 Moto Ski, and I've owned 2 Fury parts sleds, and probably over half a dozen Invaders over the years. But I now down to just Deere's and a few Cats.

-Rainville

JDT · Post by **JDT** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 1:01 am

I have two 79 CC El Tigre's and one 76 CC Cat. Would like to nab a 77 but they are tough to find. They shouldn't be as they made 600 both years. Last 77 I saw on the makert, I think it was Ed Webb's, went for some serious money.

JoeRainville · Post by **JoeRainville** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 1:41 pm

Todd,

I think they made about 625 76 CC Cat's, but only about 147 of the 77 L/C model. There was one for sale here in NY this fall, but I didn't have the play money after buying my IFS proto at Hay Days.

Keep looking, they are out there!

-Joe

boaski · Post by **boaski** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 2:42 pm

I don't mean to draw the ire of anyone but, having newer sleds around helps me enjoy the old ones more. What I consider "newer" may be different than some. My newest sled is a 2002 XC700SP Edge. I also have a 99 Polaris Super Sport, a 1997 Polaris Sport & my son has a 1997 Polaris Indy 500 sitting in the barn. We used to go to Michigan or Penn for a weekend once a year but haven't been able to do that for a few years. We mostly ride fields in the area & have put on 100 miles in a decent afternoon / evening running around locally. We don't have a lot of snow in our part of Ohio, so when it does snow I want to ride. There is no comparison to running around on the '02 Edge vs trying to cover the same amount of miles on the '80 Liquifire. I'm 45 & I definitely feel it more the next day after riding the old ones. It's a mater of different expectations when I'm on different sleds.

My 1963 Sno Traveler is probably the last sled that would go if I had to get rid of them, but I'll tell you; 10 miles on that sled is an adventure and you better be prepared to have about an hour available to make the trip. On a newer sled it's a 10 minute bop across the field to make sure it's warmed up. I got out our '79 Ski Doo Elite last night. The thing weighs about 800# and it tops out at about 35 or 40 mph on a good day. You also sit right in the middle of the chassis, so it's got a "rider forward" design from 30 years ago. It won't compare to a Polaris Rush, but I'd like to see you cruise around on a Rush with 2 people on board while listening to the radio.

As far as the new Polaris Rush: I'm glad Polaris is looking for a way to stretch the envelope a little. That doesn't mean that everybody HAS to buy a new sled, it just means the "technology front" of the sport is still moving forward. Switch from a JDX8 to a Spitfire to a 80's Liquifire and you can tell a definite level of improvement with each step. It doesn't mean the last model was any less of a good sled, it just means that technology changes as it moves forward.

If you haven't ridden a newer sled you need it give it a try. You'll still love your 'deere's, you'll just realize they aren't the pinnacle of technological achievement in regard to snowmobiles (after all, that's the 1974 Boa Ski SS

)

S_Kyle · Post by **S_Kyle** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 3:19 pm

I plan on getting a newish sled in the next year or so, but will never give up the relics. I like the idea of longer trail rides. There is really no way of comparing a relic to new sled. Take the snowcruisers/johnson/evinrudes, the may have two skies and a track but that's where it ends. I pretty much have to move and load the sled the day before I ride or I will be too tired to wrestle the beast over the terrain. I plan to hold on to the relics as long as I can, the problem is we seem to be loosing the vintage events around here due to, too many problems with new sleds.